ST: Generations and TNG s2e15 “Q Who”
Momma ain’t raise no snitch
El-Aurians are “listeners” not “talkers” 🤣
Well… let’s just say that Guinan knows what humans can be like, sometimes…
Makes sense, that was during Starfleet’s “RA RA HUMANITY!” phase, so maybe they didn’t take it seriously.
Maybe that’s why Q warned Picard and not the leadership of the El-Aurians. He realized Picard was most likely to take the threat seriously and have the clout to sell it to the Admiralty.
Is the Sisko’s dad as an Admiral? Retired and started his own restaurant!
After the shit he pulled at Khitomer, he had to change his identity and hide.
Yeah, he was a Bad miral
nah i don’t see it
Guinan didn’t tell Mark Twain about warp drive and El-Aurians either. They probably have a “don’t ask don’t tell” policy.
Mark Twain wasn’t in danger of being assimilated at that time. By the late 23rd century, it would be considered a courtesy to warn surrounding systems of the impending threat.
There was no real Borg threat to the federation until Q interfered, Guinan said as much to Picard in Q Who
There was an episode in season one where Federation and Romulan outposts had gone missing, being scooped out of the ground. The writer’s intention with this, at least, was to hint at the Borg poking around the edge of Federation territory before they were introduced on-screen. Guinan could have said something then, about six months before Q stepped in.
Except that was going to be about the bug things in the previous episode. The Borg weren’t really conceived until season 2.
You get outta here with that doyleism, this is watsonian territory
even so, the connection was confirmed by Shelby on the ground in Best of Both Worlds Part 1 - she and Data scanned the scooped-out area and matched the method to the lost border colonies.
I’m not saying she shouldn’t have, I’m saying she has a long track record of not helping.
Well, there was that one time she agreed to summon Q.
I mean, look at our current situation. Migrants are a center point of political division. Those against them don’t believe a word they say.
“An unseen, unknown alien species chased you out of your home and you’re looking for refuge? Uh huh. Right. One moment please. … Hello ICE? Found some more criminal scum to deport.”
It’s a hyperbole, but the meaning stands. Generally, refugees aren’t taken seriously in regards to their motives nor are they in a respectable position. Any bureaucrat or aid worker taking their statements would be like
“Yes, yes. No need to worry! The big bad space Borch cube won’t be turning anyone into soup any time soon. You’re safe now! So have this warm tea instead!”Its almost as if Generations is a poorly written movie…
I didn’t watch much of Enterprise but weren’t the Borg in that also?
Also both Cochrane and his assistant Lily knew of the Borg prior the first warp flight.
so at the very least in 3 different occasions the Federation/Starfleet would have known that the Borg existed but just decided to keep those cards close to their chests?
They mentioned somewhere that Cochrane in old age talked about cyborgs, but everyone thought he went nuts.
Sloane had about 45 minutes worth of traumatic interaction with the Borg while also dealing with all the futuristic stuff Picardy dumped on her and Cochrane’s was seemingly just ramblings from an elderly alcoholic. I’d doubt anyone from the future left them with detailed intelligence files on the Borg.
Then 50 years later a remote outpost finds something but kinda gets wiped out with only some hearsay from a couple officers. Fledging Starfleet may not have even connected the dotted-line.
But did B-era Guinan even know if it was the Borg who attacked her planet? Or could it just be massive starships just showed up and started wiping out her planet and only long after the fact was it proven to be Borg?
Yeah, I think it’s an open question as to when Starfleet knew about the Borg.
It actually seems totally reasonable to me that the reports about strange cybernetic beings from Cochrane’s, and later Archer’s, time might not necessarily get connected to the El Aurian refugees or Picard’s first encounter with a cube.
After all, the old reports from 150 years ago, from TNG’s point of view, only happened due to temporal shenanigans and would probably have been super-duper classified.
My people encountered them a century ago. They destroyed our cities. They scattered my people throughout the galaxy. They’re called the Borg. Protect yourself, Captain, or they’ll destroy you.
Yeah, but after the rescue and all the survivors being debriefed by Starfleet, did they outright say “it’s a massive hive-mind of cybernetic organisms called the Borg who assimilate entire civilizations and can adapt in minutes to any attack you throw at it”? Or “a large invading force showed up, we don’t know who they are or where they came from”
They usually give the whole “you will be assimilated” spiel beforehand but hard to say if that would be something that the common folks would know or only world leaders
I dont recall any Borg in ENT and I just finished it a couple weeks ago
Edit: i wrong
s2e23 “Regeneration”
I think the report on them gets buried or dismissed.
Oh damn you right, I forgot about that one
You were probably too distracted by an exciting game of water polo.
yes, but they were made an unamed species, eventhough we already know. and they were canonizing the fact the borg from tng recieved the signal that was sent during enterprises time period 200 years ago to the delta quadrant.
They just don’t take it seriously but they are somewhat known hell seven’s parents studied them from following rumors over a decade pre the next generation.
Not the worst parents in Trek , or even just Voyager. This is not how “Take your daughter to work” is supposed to go.
These two make Worf look like father of the year.
one is a crossroad demon so yes.
They were all the way on the other side of the galaxy with niether Borg or Human realistically ever meeting and the Borg didn’t even know about humans until Q showed them the Enterprise and its crew.
If anything, Q put humanity (and the entire Alpha quadrant) in danger with his bullshit.
the Borg didn’t even know about humans until Q showed them the Enterprise and its crew.
The Borg had already assimilated Annika, Magnus and Erin Hansen, so they knew all about Earth.
I like to think that despite his apparent antagonism, Q did what he did in order to save humanity. That by showing us this existential threat, humanity could begin to prepare for it instead of being lulled into a false sense of security and get assimilated.
Or Q is just an asshole.
Q is an asshole, but I feel like Q also used the Borg to protect the Federation against the Dominion.
In canon during TNG, the Federation has become very weak as a military power. Without the Klingons as a threat, Starfleet is a shell of its former self. It uses century old ships in service and ended two wars it should have won in a stalemate. Q forces an encounter with the Borg which shows the Federation is nowhere near equipped to win, then the next encounter wipes out a significant number of ships. So, starting after Wolf 359, the Federation starts a massive rearmament campaign.
Those new fleet designs end up being crucial to the Federation having a chance in the Dominion War. It is also telling that Q visited Sisko only once. People joke that Q didn’t come back because Sisko punched Q, but that did show Q that Sisko was willing to use force to defend himself.
Both things can be true
guinan was on earth 500yo prior to TNG, she couldve warned them then too, unless the borg attack happened very recently by the time of tng.
I’ve often thought this myself.
Doesn’t help that the episode aired in '89 and the film in '94.
Seems they wanted an excuse to shoehorn in Guinan with 0 regard for continuity.
She also had just been kicked out of what was essentially an addictive paradise that traps you in your ideal dream world. Pretty easy to miss a few details in that situation.
In the moment, of course. The decades following, however…
they listen.
The Elordians - the Elordians have come!The ban from cochrane was still in effect
